[ScottG]

I believe you may have misunderstood me, I only included enhancement drugs to be all-inclusive, rather then restricting the parameters of the thread to only recreational-type drugs.  The use of gear, in my opinion qualities as a vice, even if don't get a direct chemical high off if it.

(Though some would point to the increased sexual drive and power-strength while using gear as form of chemically induced high, too, so I'm not going to argue against that part.)

The central question is about vice in the form of alcohol and/or drugs as an element to a story, as pertaining to certain characters.  Again, I stressed the fact (see my original posting) that it could be anyone, the hero, the heroine, the villain, the villainette or one of the supporting characters, major or minor of the story.

My bad.  I belive there was a misunderstanding on my part.  In the case of alcohol, I could see using it somehow, but I am adamantly against drugs of any kind (not even that big on prescriptions) so I would say – no, I would not use those in a story.

[TC2]

For me the answer lies in who is going to see or read my story and what the character symbolizes.

For instance,

If I'm creating a superhero that will have a high chance of children seeing the story I will remove any references to drugs, alcohol, and even smoking as these kids will look at these characters as role models.  If my characters are going to set an example then I will do what I can to make that example something that they SHOULD follow.

Now…

If I don't have a young mind demographic this allows me more freedom to experiment with different characters.  There are certain places where a character with an addiction is simply perfect for the story in mind and I would present it in the most tasteful fashion possible.  However, it's very rare that include those types of characters in say FMG stories because I don't like the girls I tend to idolize to have a plague of bad habits with them.  I think transforming into a berserk she-hulk is enough of a problem as it is, she doesn't need to be doing drugs at the same time!

The opportunities for me to use those types of characters is very rare for me, but if I'm inspired and the story calls for it then it would certainly make an appearance.

[KeithXZ]

In general I think you'd want to be guided by what your character would do.  If you are writing for adults, even in a morality play you want the characters to be realistic.

If your character is consumed with concerns of health, strength and endurance, consider:
a) "Would a person like that smoke?" 
b) "Would a person that use a particular kind of drug?"

So generally:

They won't smoke tobacco, unless they are really dumb. 

They won't do drugs that they believe are harmful to the body. 

If they are diabetic they will take their insulin. 

They probably will take a ASA or acetaminophen if they have a headache. 

They might take steroids, because they are thinking about short term benefit, not potential long harm. 

They won't take crack or heroin because those drugs are quickly harmful to the body.  Any short term bliss is quickly outweighed, in their value system, by the damage to the body.

I go along with the "heroes for children and teens should be squeaky clean" principle. 

One could take morality even further:  Superheros should have to earn their powers in some way. 

Having superpowers arbitrarily granted discourages children and teens from the principle that achievements are the rewards for effort.  (In the bodybuilding industry: no pain no gain.)

Buffy TVS is part way towards this.  As a slayer, she is born with the potential, but you frequently see her training to turn that potential into reality.  To me this is more moral than the original 1960s squeaky clean superman, who is super-powered simply by the accidental good fortune of being born Kryptonian.  He didn't do anything to earn his superpowers. 

Same deal with intelligence and money.  Although a lot of the wealth in the world is inherited, if you are trying to promote morality, it is more moral to have your heroes earn for their wealth.  Villains can inherit wealth.

I agree that it would require a lot of thought and a long plot to have a write a morality play describing some character putting in the effort to earn superpowers.

Of course the stories here are seldom morality plays, so this point about earning superpowers doesn't really matter.

Anyway, those are my opinions.

In the old days (pre-1970s), tobacco companies ensured that most heroes in films smoked.  I've even seen characters smoking in submarines in the cheapest old WWII films.  This was part of tobacco marketing.  It drew away from making the character realistic.

[Evan Stanley]

In general I think you'd want to be guided by what your character would do.  If you are writing for adults, even in a morality play you want the characters to be realistic.

If your character is consumed with concerns of health, strength and endurance, consider:
a) "Would a person like that smoke?" 
b) "Would a person that use a particular kind of drug?"

So generally:

They won't smoke tobacco, unless they are really dumb. 

They won't do drugs that they believe are harmful to the body. 

If they are diabetic they will take their insulin. 

They probably will take a ASA or acetaminophen if they have a headache. 

They might take steroids, because they are thinking about short term benefit, not potential long harm. 

They won't take crack or heroin because those drugs are quickly harmful to the body.  Any short term bliss is quickly outweighed, in their value system, by the damage to the body.

I go along with the "heroes for children and teens should be squeaky clean" principle. 

One could take morality even further:  Superheros should have to earn their powers in some way. 

Having superpowers arbitrarily granted discourages children and teens from the principle that achievements are the rewards for effort.  (In the bodybuilding industry: no pain no gain.)

Buffy TVS is part way towards this.  As a slayer, she is born with the potential, but you frequently see her training to turn that potential into reality.  To me this is more moral than the original 1960s squeaky clean superman, who is super-powered simply by the accidental good fortune of being born Kryptonian.  He didn't do anything to earn his superpowers. 

Same deal with intelligence and money.  Although a lot of the wealth in the world is inherited, if you are trying to promote morality, it is more moral to have your heroes earn for their wealth.  Villains can inherit wealth.

I agree that it would require a lot of thought and a long plot to have a write a morality play describing some character putting in the effort to earn superpowers.

Of course the stories here are seldom morality plays, so this point about earning superpowers doesn't really matter.

Anyway, those are my opinions.

In the old days (pre-1970s), tobacco companies ensured that most heroes in films smoked.  I've even seen characters smoking in submarines in the cheapest old WWII films.  This was part of tobacco marketing.  It drew away from making the character realistic.

Sadly, this sounds too much to me like the old idea that a strong work ethic and being a hard worker gets you ahead in life, which is blatantly false. Time and time again I've seen promotions and benefits handed out to those that shared a last name, or were close friends. Or people that kissed the most ass. In general the hardest workers tend to stay nothing more than grunts, cause they are good at it and management wants them there. Its the worthless brown nosers that go up the chain of command.

I've had far, FAR too many jobs were I worked ten times as hard to earn one-third the pay.

The moral? Shoulda started my own business.

[Prophet Tenebrae]

I'll say this, there's a lot to be said for the security of a faceless corporation rewarding your inefficiency, working for yourself or your own business… you can be inefficient… sure but you're just fucking yourself.

Anyway. Currently, I've got a story where a girl finds a recreational drug – I suppose it's like viagra squared – that usually just has minor effects to the body makes her get big… initially, she loves it. Somewhat ironically, her roomie gets addicted to the effects, so covertly feeds it to her.

So, somewhat.. grey, ethically.

[demented20]

Sadly, this sounds too much to me like the old idea that a strong work ethic and being a hard worker gets you ahead in life, which is blatantly false. Time and time again I've seen promotions and benefits handed out to those that shared a last name, or were close friends. Or people that kissed the most ass. In general the hardest workers tend to stay nothing more than grunts, cause they are good at it and management wants them there. Its the worthless brown nosers that go up the chain of command.

I've had far, FAR too many jobs were I worked ten times as hard to earn one-third the pay.

The moral? Shoulda started my own business.

I started my own business 4 years ago, and let me tell you that there is still ass that must be kissed. Its just that you're kissing up to clients and not to bosses. Same thing, but when you work for yourself and you don't kiss up then you don't miss out on a promotion, you don't eat.

Just wanted to drop that in there… On to substance using characters..
This thread has been going for a while, and at first I sort of lumped it in with the "smoking character" thread, but there is a difference since smoking and drinking are legal, and this thread's talking about drugs.

Some people have brought up the age of the readers, and this hadn't really occurred to me because I didn't even discover FM stories until I was 18. There is something to the fact that younger people might read a story not knowing that there is drug use or that a character has a really dark side. I thought about it and then I realized that I read "Silence of the Lambs" when I was 13 or 14. I read "The Shining" when I was 13 or so, and the list goes on. So it would depend on how mature the reader is more than the age.
Besides, there are lots of sexually mature stories written in the FM genre. I think there's plenty of room for other mature topics to be included besides just sex and violence.

[AlexG]

Just wanted to drop that in there… On to substance using characters..
This thread has been going for a while, and at first I sort of lumped it in with the "smoking character" thread, but there is a difference since smoking and drinking are legal, and this thread's talking about drugs.

Well, in point of fact, when I started each of the threads I intentionally separated the smoking from that of drugs AND alcohol, by labeling the latter two together as "substance-using", which is broad enough a term to include enhancement drugs – i.e. steroids.

That tobacco and alcohol are legal, while the others are not (to varying degrees) never was an issue in my mind for compartmentalizing them.  That there is a certain fanatical (health uber allus) segment of (western) society busily at work to make tobacco use near as to illegal as can be, well, you could say that it also falls into a gray area of what's "legal", too.

“I like a good story well told. That is the reason I am sometimes forced to tell them myself.”
~ Mark Twain / Samuel Clemens (1907)

[BlackKusanagi]

I would. If it can keep the character somewhat interesting and fresh, why not.

[JimmyDimples]

Sorry I'm late to the party on this one.  Anyhow…

On drugs, well I HAD done this before in my fanfic China Will Grow Larger:  I had minor bad guy Lao Zi Bom smoking "special flowers" from his General's hookah.  Later he was quite stoned.

On that toke-n, I have to concur that I do include it, but it's strictly for the bad guys. I have to jump on the "straight-edge hero/Users Are Losers" bandwagon.

Although… I had toyed with the idea of a possible story where a weaker female tries an experimental super-substance/"gear" that grants her grand strength… but ultimately she's caught in the classic struggle between keeping her new power or her soul.

[Evan Stanley]

I have to jump on the "straight-edge hero/Users Are Losers" bandwagon.

I'm with that as well, unless the substance in question is the SOURCE of her strength.

[Author]

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